Digital Decorum: Navigating the Do’s and Don’ts of Online Meetings

00;00;08;09 - 00;00;18;17
Marisa Eikenberry
Welcome back to Long-Distance Worklife, where we help you lead, work and thrive in remote and hybrid teams. I'm Marisa Eikenberry, a fellow remote worker. And joining me is my co-host and remote work expert, Wayne Turmel.

00;00;18;20 - 00;00;20;17
Wayne Turmel
That would be me. Hi. How are you?

00;00;20;23 - 00;00;22;07
Marisa Eikenberry
I'm great. How are you?

00;00;22;10 - 00;00;33;07
Wayne Turmel
I'm great. It feels like a million years since we have recorded one of these. So this could be fun. Or it could be a car wreck. This is the joy of recording live, right?

00;00;33;12 - 00;01;00;02
Marisa Eikenberry
Yeah. I was going to say, I mean, for those that are now scared, if you're first time listeners, do not shut this off, but that being said, today we're actually going to talk about acceptable meeting behaviors. So we actually got this survey sent to us by our boss, Kevin. And so it's a 2023 YouGov survey that was done of just different, acceptable or unacceptable leading behaviors.

00;01;00;02 - 00;01;04;27
Marisa Eikenberry
And they start off with just behaviors in general. And then we actually go into generational stuff.

00;01;04;29 - 00;01;25;10
Wayne Turmel
But now just to clarify, for the mere mortals out there who can't read our minds, YouGov is essentially this is a survey, internal survey of U.S. federal workers in all the branches, all the divisions, all the stuff right.

00;01;25;12 - 00;01;27;03
Marisa Eikenberry
Now, lots and lots of people.

00;01;27;05 - 00;01;27;27
Wayne Turmel
Context.

00;01;28;03 - 00;01;50;04
Marisa Eikenberry
Yeah, exactly. And one of the first things that they did talk about, which we've talked about before, you know, we mentioned remote work, is that while we would like to think that this is a majority of the population, the majority of the population is not remote working. But they talked about 32% of Americans participate in virtual meetings for work and 37% for like personal calls.

00;01;50;07 - 00;02;05;16
Marisa Eikenberry
So so that's where we're going with this. But Wayne, were there any that kind of stuck out to you from this first, you know, acceptable, not acceptable, graphic. And for those of you that are watching, I'm going to have this up on the screen.

00;02;05;18 - 00;02;23;23
Wayne Turmel
Yeah, I think if we look at the general numbers, we're not getting generational or granular on this, just in general. Certain things make sense, right? Having a TV on in the background, smoking, although that's interesting.

00;02;23;26 - 00;02;25;22
Marisa Eikenberry
Okay. So why is it interesting to you?

00;02;25;26 - 00;02;56;05
Wayne Turmel
Well, it says a whole lot more about where society is gone than where the meetings have gone. Because if we think about why smoking was banned in the workplace, second hand smoke being rude and blowing smoke in somebody's face, all of that good stuff. A lot of people take remote meetings in the privacy of their own home or a hotel room, wherever they happen to be.

00;02;56;08 - 00;03;01;21
Wayne Turmel
And secondhand smoke is not an issue. You cannot catch secondhand smoke.

00;03;01;23 - 00;03;03;16
Marisa Eikenberry
Right through.

00;03;03;16 - 00;03;05;03
Wayne Turmel
Zoom.

00;03;05;06 - 00;03;07;05
Marisa Eikenberry
That is true.

00;03;07;08 - 00;03;24;28
Wayne Turmel
So I think that says more about the fact that people just don't want anybody smoking at all. Whether or not it's rude on a meeting. Now, some of that is I come from the generation where I can remember people smoking in meetings.

00;03;25;00 - 00;03;32;07
Marisa Eikenberry
Yeah, See that? I can't remember. I was old enough to still remember smoking in restaurants and there being a section for both.

00;03;32;09 - 00;03;36;03
Wayne Turmel
And of course, I live in Las Vegas where you can still do that.

00;03;36;10 - 00;03;52;15
Marisa Eikenberry
All right. Well, and then for our audio listeners, so for smoking, they said, you know, 75% of those surveyed said it's not acceptable in any meeting, while 12% said it's acceptable in informal meetings. And five said it's, 5% said it's acceptable in any meeting.

00;03;52;17 - 00;04;27;27
Wayne Turmel
Yeah. One of the interesting things I found about this report is that there is an increasing, especially among people under older than dirt. There is an increasing gap between what it's okay to do in an informal meeting, you know teammates a teammate than in a formal meeting where you're doing a sales presentation or you have a customer on the line or whatever that works out to.

00;04;27;27 - 00;04;31;03
Wayne Turmel
I think that is interesting.

00;04;31;05 - 00;04;32;03
Marisa Eikenberry
yeah, for sure.

00;04;32;05 - 00;04;39;24
Wayne Turmel
And where you find that a lot is, is it okay to have a child or a pet in your lap?

00;04;39;26 - 00;04;41;05
Marisa Eikenberry
Right.

00;04;41;07 - 00;04;51;25
Wayne Turmel
And interestingly, more people find it acceptable to have a pet in your lap than a kid in your lap, which in a strange way makes sense.

00;04;52;00 - 00;04;54;21
Marisa Eikenberry
It really does.

00;04;54;24 - 00;05;23;18
Wayne Turmel
But, you know, I can remember when remote work started to catch on. If you wanted to know whether or not somebody worked remotely on a regular basis or not, you'd be on a conference call and a dog would bark. And the people who worked remotely would say, say hi to Bailey for me. And the people who didn't work remotely were like, Is that a dog?

00;05;23;21 - 00;05;38;00
Wayne Turmel
Like they'd never heard a dog before? Right. And so I think that gap between formal and informal, if I'm just talking to you, you know, I don't care.

00;05;38;02 - 00;05;40;21
Marisa Eikenberry
Right, Right, Exactly. Like Max Barks. And it's fine.

00;05;40;28 - 00;05;46;26
Wayne Turmel
Yeah. Max barks Or he jumps in my lap and I hold him up and go say hi to Auntie Marisa. Right, right.

00;05;46;28 - 00;05;52;21
Marisa Eikenberry
Right. Yeah. My husband drops in behind me, and I'm just like, my God, Go away.

00;05;52;23 - 00;06;00;02
Wayne Turmel
And I'm going, Hi, Parker. Right. Say hi to Uncle Ray.

00;06;00;04 - 00;06;11;20
Wayne Turmel
So I think some of those are really interesting where you start to see some gaps. Is. Is it okay to eat?

00;06;11;22 - 00;06;12;11
Marisa Eikenberry
Right? Right.

00;06;12;15 - 00;06;28;22
Wayne Turmel
Is it okay to drink? There is a percentage of humans and I'm looking for it. And I'm wondering who these evil people are. 3%. No, it's not 3%. It's. I'm looking for drinking and nonalcoholic drinks.

00;06;28;25 - 00;06;37;19
Marisa Eikenberry
Yeah. So 17% say it's not acceptable in any medium. 53% say it's acceptable in any meeting. And 22 say only informal meetings.

00;06;37;23 - 00;06;42;06
Wayne Turmel
Yeah. The Geneva Convention says people are allowed hydration. Right.

00;06;42;08 - 00;07;04;19
Marisa Eikenberry
Like I remember looking at this would be like, I don't think I have ever been bothered by somebody taking a drink ever. I can understand not wanting to be on a meeting and it's not a happy hour and like, they're clearly drinking a beer. Like, that's a problem. I get that. But like, I have a soda with me all the time and I drink it in meetings all the time.

00;07;04;19 - 00;07;08;04
Marisa Eikenberry
And I never thought about it being a problem until I saw that.

00;07;08;06 - 00;07;11;07
Wayne Turmel
Well, until we hold the intervention.

00;07;11;09 - 00;07;16;06
Marisa Eikenberry
Well, you know, it could be worse.

00;07;16;08 - 00;07;27;07
Wayne Turmel
So, you know, if we look at it, it's not really surprising what people think is acceptable and unacceptable. I suppose.

00;07;27;09 - 00;07;31;01
Wayne Turmel
It gets interesting around formal and informal meetings.

00;07;31;07 - 00;07;32;09
Marisa Eikenberry


00;07;32;11 - 00;08;06;19
Wayne Turmel
Right. And I have been on informal meetings. And again, everything is context, right? Right. I belong to a writer's group. We used to regularly have cocktails during our meetings. Yeah. If we're talking about it, work. I have had meetings with people overseas who, you know, are taking the meeting out of the kindness of their heart. But it's after dinner and they have a glass of wine or a beer with them as we're having it.

00;08;06;19 - 00;08;08;12
Wayne Turmel
And it doesn't bother me.

00;08;08;15 - 00;08;09;04
Marisa Eikenberry
Right.

00;08;09;06 - 00;08;25;21
Wayne Turmel
First of all, they're the customer. What am I going to say? Okay. But also, it's an informal discussion. And I want I want a heightened level of informality because I think you communicate better that way.

00;08;25;27 - 00;08;41;11
Marisa Eikenberry
Right. Yeah. I mean, I've been on some, you know, virtual happy hour stuff with sorority sorority meetings or webinars or whatever. And it's just like, yeah, like it's 9:00. If I have a cocktail, it's fine. If they have a cocktail, it's fine.

00;08;41;14 - 00;08;52;23
Wayne Turmel
Now, one of the ones which is very personal to me because and people who regularly view this don't know this, but I wear hats a lot.

00;08;52;25 - 00;08;54;22
Marisa Eikenberry
I thought about you when I saw the.

00;08;54;25 - 00;09;22;26
Wayne Turmel
Different types of hats, but you'll notice that nobody on this podcast has ever seen me wearing a hat because I differentiate between work Wayne and Wayne in the rest of my life. However, the one time I do wear a hat on a work call is because I live on the West Coast. My day starts way earlier than everybody else's.

00;09;23;03 - 00;09;52;20
Wayne Turmel
And if somebody's not necessarily a client, but if somebody on our team or somebody like that calls a meeting for 9:00 Eastern time, there is a pretty good chance I am not going to be showered and presentable. Right. And so I can throw on a shirt that's not a big deal, but all off and put on a baseball cap just so I don't look like Albert Einstein.

00;09;52;22 - 00;10;09;25
Marisa Eikenberry
Well, I thought it was interesting, too, when I was seeing that, because, you know, we had a team member that she wore hats frequently and that was just part of her style. That was just how she was. And I was never bothered by it. When I would see out, it was usually a wow, like that. That's cool hat.

00;10;09;25 - 00;10;18;29
Marisa Eikenberry
I hadn't seen or wear that one before or something like that. So I definitely found it interesting it being on this because it is an issue.

00;10;19;06 - 00;10;26;06
Wayne Turmel
Most people who wear hats do it as a cheap attempt at branding and difference. Yeah, it's just myself included.

00;10;26;13 - 00;10;27;21
Marisa Eikenberry
Right.

00;10;27;23 - 00;10;32;06
Wayne Turmel
So that particular person that was part of her wacky.

00;10;32;09 - 00;10;32;26
Marisa Eikenberry
Yeah, That was her.

00;10;32;26 - 00;10;52;07
Wayne Turmel
Laid back style and it was great. One of the things that is important, if you're going to do that, though, and baseball caps are a problem for this, is they affect the lighting over your eyes and very often make it hard for people to see your eyes. And that can be a problem.

00;10;52;09 - 00;10;55;13
Marisa Eikenberry
Right. And I can totally see that right.

00;10;55;16 - 00;11;04;16
Wayne Turmel
Now where things get ugly as we look at that is generationally.

00;11;04;18 - 00;11;05;27
Marisa Eikenberry
Yes.

00;11;06;00 - 00;11;20;09
Wayne Turmel
What people find acceptable and what they don't. I used to think I was pretty cool. And and I do differentiate between formal and informal meetings.

00;11;20;11 - 00;11;21;10
Marisa Eikenberry
Right.

00;11;21;13 - 00;11;36;12
Wayne Turmel
And since extremely formal has never been my style. I'm fairly relaxed about some things, sometimes more than I should be. And I am a child of my generation.

00;11;36;15 - 00;11;38;23
Marisa Eikenberry
Right. Okay, So give us an example.

00;11;38;25 - 00;11;55;01
Wayne Turmel
I'm 62 years old, right? I'm looking at where there's a huge difference in what's acceptable and what's unacceptable. You know, walking around the room during the meeting.

00;11;55;03 - 00;11;56;17
Marisa Eikenberry
Right.

00;11;56;19 - 00;12;19;18
Wayne Turmel
There is no reason not to do that. I'm when I'm in the conference room, I very often because my joints ache and stuff and I have the attention span of an Irish setter, so I have to burn off energy. So I'll stand and move to the back of the room. Right. Stand against the back wall or something while the meeting is going on.

00;12;19;21 - 00;12;29;17
Wayne Turmel
I tend not to do that on virtual meetings, but I think that's largely a function of my camera setup.

00;12;29;19 - 00;12;30;26
Marisa Eikenberry
Right.

00;12;30;29 - 00;12;44;04
Wayne Turmel
I'm on camera most of the time. If it's a telephone call, I'll walk down. There are there are ruts in our carpet from where I pace and walk during a comp during a telephone call.

00;12;44;10 - 00;12;46;04
Marisa Eikenberry
Right.

00;12;46;06 - 00;12;59;00
Wayne Turmel
But generally speaking, I'm a little more particularly if it's a camera meeting, I'm a little more traditional. Like now. I'll sit there like a good boy and do it.

00;12;59;02 - 00;13;15;04
Marisa Eikenberry
Yeah, I do it too. And I have been on meetings or even streams that I watch where like, people have gotten up. And I think for me the issue is less that they've gotten up. It's that their mic is set up for that. And so now they're talking, I can't hear you.

00;13;15;08 - 00;13;20;23
Wayne Turmel
You know what's worse? I just realized when I want to throttle the person.

00;13;20;25 - 00;13;21;26
Marisa Eikenberry
Okay.

00;13;21;28 - 00;13;23;29
Wayne Turmel
Not that I would.

00;13;24;01 - 00;13;25;04
Marisa Eikenberry
Because you're virtual, so you're.

00;13;25;04 - 00;14;01;15
Wayne Turmel
Actually laying hands on another human being is wrong. It's okay to want to just don't do it that way. But the big one for me and it's because I never do this, is I, I don't do face time or meetings, especially work meetings on my phone. When I'm having a conversation, a webcam conversation with they're on their phone and they're walking, and it's like being on the deck of the Titanic.

00;14;01;17 - 00;14;25;18
Marisa Eikenberry
Like, it's super distracting. Well, not only that, but, like, okay, I'm. Somebody gets motion sick, really easy. And still, I literally cannot watch people do that. Like, I know it's a thing. And we've we've had people on our own team that have done that occasionally. And I'm just like, I literally have to hide your camera because otherwise I'm a puke all over the.

00;14;25;20 - 00;14;26;14
Wayne Turmel
Yeah.

00;14;26;16 - 00;14;30;26
Marisa Eikenberry
I am surprised that that wasn't mentioned in this list.

00;14;30;28 - 00;14;40;13
Wayne Turmel
Yeah. I mean, it was I don't know, you know, the problem with surveys is they people answer the question that you ask.

00;14;40;15 - 00;14;41;18
Marisa Eikenberry
Right.

00;14;41;20 - 00;14;59;24
Wayne Turmel
Right. Nobody says, by the way. Yeah. This drives me crazy, too. I think the biggest one and this is true of the workplace in general, which gets generational conflict is what you're wearing on your call.

00;14;59;26 - 00;15;04;10
Marisa Eikenberry
Right. Yeah. So.

00;15;04;13 - 00;15;17;25
Wayne Turmel
So is it okay to wear your pajamas, you know? Do you wear what you sleep in on a zoom meeting? And, you know, I sleep naked, so the answer is no.

00;15;17;27 - 00;15;20;05
Marisa Eikenberry
Thank you.

00;15;20;07 - 00;15;23;24
Wayne Turmel
Welcome to another edition of too much information.

00;15;23;26 - 00;15;29;29
Marisa Eikenberry
Like, unplug my headphones about. Do not need to know.

00;15;30;01 - 00;15;38;24
Wayne Turmel
But. But it drives me crazy. My daughter wears pajamas. 24 seven. She goes to the grocery store in a onesie.

00;15;38;27 - 00;15;39;23
Marisa Eikenberry
No.

00;15;39;25 - 00;15;41;20
Wayne Turmel
It drives me insane.

00;15;41;22 - 00;15;43;13
Marisa Eikenberry
Well, she's about a year younger than me.

00;15;43;21 - 00;15;44;04
Wayne Turmel
Yes.

00;15;44;11 - 00;15;55;17
Marisa Eikenberry
Okay. See, I was also the weird person, and I will confess, I'm weird that I wouldn't go to college classes in pajamas, and I felt like it was very respectful or disrespectful When. Why would somebody.

00;15;55;17 - 00;16;01;22
Wayne Turmel
Go to college classes in pajamas? Why would you leave your dorm room?

00;16;01;25 - 00;16;06;02
Marisa Eikenberry
We had 8 a.m. classes and I was like the only one in jeans.

00;16;06;04 - 00;16;09;15
Wayne Turmel
I Yeah. But now you're an old soul.

00;16;09;18 - 00;16;10;06
Marisa Eikenberry
That is true.

00;16;10;08 - 00;16;20;01
Wayne Turmel
So, you know, I can appreciate that. That's. That's why I adore you. But it's not. But, Jim, is there, like, an obvious example?

00;16;20;03 - 00;16;20;25
Marisa Eikenberry
Correct.

00;16;20;27 - 00;16;21;09
Wayne Turmel
Right.

00;16;21;16 - 00;16;23;10
Marisa Eikenberry
Right.

00;16;23;12 - 00;16;48;28
Wayne Turmel
But what do you wear on a call? And again, context matters. Right. Right. If I'm working from home and because I'm always working from home and you have a question and we have to get on a zoom or whatever, call real quick. If I'm in my gym shorts, you know, if I'm not dressed 100% professionally, it doesn't matter because it's you and me.

00;16;48;28 - 00;16;51;14
Wayne Turmel
It's going to be a five minute conversation and we're out.

00;16;51;20 - 00;16;53;12
Marisa Eikenberry
Yep.

00;16;53;15 - 00;16;56;02
Wayne Turmel
If I'm in front of a customer, a.

00;16;56;05 - 00;16;58;03
Marisa Eikenberry
Totally different ballgame.

00;16;58;06 - 00;17;03;15
Wayne Turmel
You know, from the hips up, I need to be dressed like an adult.

00;17;03;22 - 00;17;04;28
Marisa Eikenberry
Right.

00;17;05;00 - 00;17;09;28
Wayne Turmel
I have worn a shirt, tie and cargo shorts. I have done that more than once.

00;17;10;00 - 00;17;11;06
Marisa Eikenberry
That's okay.

00;17;11;08 - 00;17;12;24
Wayne Turmel
The customer doesn't see it.

00;17;12;27 - 00;17;33;09
Marisa Eikenberry
Yeah. I mean, I've occasionally done that where I've had yoga pants and, like, something really nice or there when it's really cold in my office. I have one of those like, Snuggie blanket things that, I mean, like I it's, it's Navy blue. I put on it. I look like Cookie Monster. Like it's a thing, but it's super warm.

00;17;33;12 - 00;17;46;03
Marisa Eikenberry
But you better believe if I'm sitting here and working with it on and you or Kevin or somebody else is like, Hey, we have a meeting real quick. It's Hey, can you give me a second? And I will remove that because I do have standards. Yeah.

00;17;46;03 - 00;17;57;14
Wayne Turmel
And I think that goes to a larger conversation which is worth having someday about formality or informality in the workplace.

00;17;57;16 - 00;17;58;14
Marisa Eikenberry
Right.

00;17;58;16 - 00;18;24;17
Wayne Turmel
I was working with 45 h.r. People at a client yesterday, and we were talking about what are the things that they're dealing with and dress code and a appropriate and inappropriate clothing in the workplace has bloomed as a problem.

00;18;24;19 - 00;18;40;08
Marisa Eikenberry
Yeah, I've seen it in sorority meetings sometimes, too. And i'm like this is supposed to be business wear, and you have a denim skirt on. Like, we would have set them home if it was when I was in, but it was like, Well, we can't say that now.

00;18;40;10 - 00;18;51;04
Wayne Turmel
Yeah, it's interesting. I just go back to what somebody told me, just post-COVID when people were coming back and she goes, They've gone feral.

00;18;51;06 - 00;18;52;14
Marisa Eikenberry
Right.

00;18;52;16 - 00;19;15;08
Wayne Turmel
Like there used to be because the workplace was I mean, it was largely homogenous. But even if it wasn't homogenous demographically, there were just codes and the way things were done and they were the way things have been done for 100 years. And you had work clothes and you had plain clothes. Right, Right. It's like going to school.

00;19;15;12 - 00;19;43;02
Wayne Turmel
I had school clothes and plain clothes. They weren't the same. And when we worked from home, the it wasn't just that you're home. You can wear whatever the heck you want, but the social pressure about what you wore went down. So even now, men who wear suits to the office rarely wear a tie. Yeah, like they'll wear a jacket, button down shirt.

00;19;43;02 - 00;19;43;21
Wayne Turmel
I mean, they'll look.

00;19;43;27 - 00;19;44;18
Marisa Eikenberry
They still look nice.

00;19;44;24 - 00;19;48;16
Wayne Turmel
But they're not wearing, you know, the double Windsor at their throat.

00;19;48;19 - 00;19;50;10
Marisa Eikenberry


00;19;50;13 - 00;20;14;23
Wayne Turmel
And I think that what that does and this gets back to the Spider-Man paradox, right? With great power comes great responsibility is just because you can dress a certain way or act a certain way or get away with doing something online that you can't or wouldn't do in the office doesn't mean you should.

00;20;14;25 - 00;20;20;16
Marisa Eikenberry
Right. I mean, there's still a level of respect, both for yourself and for whomever you're on the call with.

00;20;20;18 - 00;20;34;02
Wayne Turmel
And, you know, yes, you are a grown person. Yes. You can make your own choices. You know, it's the whole thing about do you get dressed in work, appropriate attire in the morning.

00;20;34;05 - 00;20;34;19
Marisa Eikenberry
Right.

00;20;34;22 - 00;20;55;15
Wayne Turmel
Even when nobody's going to see you. Right. There is evidence psychologically that it affects how you think and how you work in your level of professionalism. And there are plenty of people who say, shut up, old man, my onesie is fine and it doesn't affect the outcome of my spreadsheet.

00;20;55;17 - 00;21;17;25
Marisa Eikenberry
Right. Like, I know some people that they feel like even when they're working from home, I'm going to wear shoes because for them, like even just having, you know, whatever they're wearing, having shoes is the thing that helps them be productive. I am not one of those people. I will admit I'm barefoot right now and have a blanket on my lap, but I'm still appropriately dressed.

00;21;17;27 - 00;21;23;10
Wayne Turmel
And so senior notes. Send your notes to Wilma Flintstone here.

00;21;23;13 - 00;21;30;01
Marisa Eikenberry
Right. But like I would have been even without this podcast, because that's just I'm just a.

00;21;30;03 - 00;21;56;05
Wayne Turmel
From the house down. It's the Wild West. You could do whatever you want from the bellybutton up. You better look like you're working. A couple of things. We are way past time and we have had an inordinate amount of fun, and I think there are some important things to think about this right? Where do the generational differences? Right.

00;21;56;07 - 00;22;25;10
Wayne Turmel
If I'm going to coach somebody about their appearance or their demeanor. Am I doing it because it's a valid business reason? Am I doing it because I am an old man? Right? Right. That is a conversation worth having when it's you and I talking. The level of formality is much lower than when I'm talking to a client. And it should be right.

00;22;25;13 - 00;22;35;01
Wayne Turmel
Right. If you are inappropriately informal in a important business meeting. Right. The VP is on the call.

00;22;35;04 - 00;22;35;24
Marisa Eikenberry
Yeah.

00;22;35;26 - 00;23;13;04
Wayne Turmel
Your AC DC T-shirt may not be the best choice, but again, it's incumbent on us. Yes, the rules are changing. Yes, they are more flexible than they ever were. And what is the minimum professional standard in your industry, on your team, in your organization? Absolutely. And those are the things we need to think about. Look at me wrapping all this up, trying real hard to sound like we've had a professional discussion instead of venting, which we've largely been discussed.

00;23;13;07 - 00;23;32;16
Marisa Eikenberry
And that being said, if you would like to know how to be more professional in your meetings and remote work, you can check out our long distance leadership series at Kevin Ikenberry, dot com slash LDL s. Thank you for listening to the long work life for shownotes transcripts and other resources. Make sure to visit long distance work dot com.

00;23;32;18 - 00;23;51;14
Marisa Eikenberry
If you haven't yet, subscribe to the podcast so you won't miss any future episodes. And while you're there, be sure to like in review. This helps us know what you love about our show. Feel free to contact us via email or LinkedIn with the links in our show notes and let us know you listen to this episode or even suggest topic for Wayne and I to tackle any future episodes we would love.

00;23;51;18 - 00;24;01;28
Wayne Turmel
And tell us. Tell us your meeting. Yes. Are we right? Are we wrong? Am I a grungy, grumpy old man yelling at clouds, or do I have a point?

00;24;02;01 - 00;24;06;12
Marisa Eikenberry
Am I just an old soul? Don't know how to act at 32 inches your shoes.

00;24;06;13 - 00;24;07;28
Wayne Turmel
Darn it.

00;24;08;00 - 00;24;16;26
Marisa Eikenberry
I might slip. Or sometimes when my feet are cool, thick you for joining us, everybody. And as Wayne likes to say, don't let the weasels get you down.